WW1 Balance

Now we have scenario cws and even tournaments I think it is time we start balancing out the main scenarios. We should start with ww1.

Entente is undeniably stronger than the central powers. All the top players agree(except njab). I personally have played all the picks more than once at this stage. Its not wildly imbalanced. If i were to estimate a win % ratio i would say 60:40 in Ententes favour.

Entente just has so many plays available. Imo cp requires 3 small buffs and in no particular order:

1. We need 3 or so trenches in Uzhhorod.



This is to prevent russia sending stacks into austria. While yes prussia can help usually the damage is already done by the time it arrives. It's a big difference if russia is forced to maneuver around lodomera. 5v1 plays on austria imo is 1 of the strongest entente metas. It's so easy to do and super effective for easy wins. Even the best austria players will struggle to handle it as france uk italy russia and serbia all gank you. Bonus points for some romania harassment.

2. We need a Turkey buff. Discuss.

Really easy country to cheese rush. Either uk and france drednaught rush gali or uk just rushes egypt trench. Turk has to play very conservatively and it's extremely hard to hold ground. While historically this should be the case, it should not be this easy for uk to wreck it. Imo give bali a spawn/defence buff or buff the spawn around turkey.

3. West germany needs a buff. Imo +500 income and some additional spawn. 15+ minimum.

While west germany falling to the allies midgame is historically accurate it is far too easy atm. On 1 hand you've the famous imp russia funding lb west cheese rush on the trenches which kills wg before t20. On the other hand you've standard imp uk and france which when efficiently managed with conservative russia funding can comfortably break a pd germany shortly after t20. Even if uk or france fuckup and mismanage a stack or lose their gen, they can still comfortably wreck wg by around t30. Theyve huge income, the micro of 2 players, powerful units and reinforcement events from america to ensure germany dies. Germany needs the extra spawn and the income so it can fund AND throw extra naval harassment at uk and france. As a bonus side effect it'll make the country more fun to play.

Looking forward to the responses.

And the abuse.

Remove 8 caps from romania and make them naval immoveable caps stop gay blitz.
Its fun to do, but not fun to recieve rape

Trenches will do nothing,no russia will be able to do more damage to ah than to itself with competent pruss,otto is fine as it is,wg needs buff to make it more balanced agreed,cp is generally weak lategame

West is fine, u boats should be lesser cost and more avaliable to fight on sea

लिखा द्वारा Thotticus Prime, 10.02.2019 at 11:33

West is fine, u boats should be lesser cost and more avaliable to fight on sea

u-boats already cost effective

In response to the need for Germany to get a buff, one thing I have seen is that the use of Heavy Artillery completely changes how the west front was once fought. Before, France and Uk would only push once tanks were available, causing a major stack warfare that needed hundreds of soldiers and tanks to win. With the new meta of rushing with Heavy Artillery, I think we need to ask ourselves is does Heavy Artillery need to be change so that the rush is not always effective at killing Germany before t30. I do believe that Germany needs extra cash for fighting a naval war. Many players who are Germany just won't make U-boats or even a navy because they want to make sure Prussia and the rest of CP can get funded when asked, or need to make Heavy Artillery to counter an early rush.

लिखा द्वारा bubartem, 10.02.2019 at 11:33

लिखा द्वारा Thotticus Prime, 10.02.2019 at 11:33

West is fine, u boats should be lesser cost and more avaliable to fight on sea

u-boats already cost effective

then increase spam?
usually when fra/uk start spamming cruiser they beat uboats ez because main focus is buffing stack or funding team

लिखा द्वारा Thotticus Prime, 10.02.2019 at 11:33

West is fine, u boats should be lesser cost and more avaliable to fight on sea

I knew i'd see something like this. West is not fine. I cannot count how many bad wests i've seen even among more notable high ranks who regularly play the map. For example i played a r11 france only a few hours ago who made 40 trenches discarding roughly 5k cash. the game went 30 turns so he threw away another 10k roughly on upkeep and heavily funded russia. In spite of this he still almost managed to solo kill my genstack by t30. I should mention that his uk ally played terribly too and suicided his gen and had 2 supplies sunk.

I also regularly see players randomly separate out their stacks from their gen dumping huge amounts of money on upkeep for no useful reason.

I'd imagine if you're wg vs wests like that it would look fine. The vast majority of scenario players i see playing this map are terrible. I should name and shame.

We are talking about at a high level. Micromanaging your units and income up close to 100% efficiency. This level of play is incomprehendible to most scen players i see.

In fact I'll name the only self proclaimed scen players I see who play the map well. There's not many.

Sirivann
Evic
Njab
Puchao

Map is fine people just need to get good with cp.

CP can win every game if it has competent players. There's so many world map fags that play. If I had control of every CP player, I'd win every game

Hahahahahaha imagine playing France so bad that it forces lao to make a balance thread.

anyways i think you might have a skewed impression about france almost stack wiping u as the was several circumstances which dont normally end up in the average game such as

-wg attacking a pure inf/con uk stack which ended up having a kill ratio of close to 1-1
-rushing thru these 40 trenches u spoke about also did a lot of damage
-getting your stack hit with 60+ ha while out in the open which took around 100-130 inf from your stack
-after t24 france got large funds from uk to spam art in south France as well as ha from the north.

with that out of the way id like the idea of trying out some buffs for cp . id like to see turk being buffed and maybe some more uboat reins for wg

I am agreed whit the first point, austria is hard to handle if all entente hit austria, and 2 cities in uz is not big difference but can help
Disagreed whit third point, germ is fine and pruss have almost a 100% win in east.
The most important point to discuss is always otto, the problem whit a otto buff is this faction will get unkillable, otto is just bad played majority of games. I will explain it:
-Gaza/iraq are the most important places to hold and it is relative easy to do just get better at it.
-Many russ players dont rush armenia but lets imagine everybody do:
Armenia front is almost imposible to hold early turns for the massive amount of russ units even if they are weak, but armenia front cities are a kind of trench cities so you only need to wall spam inner armenia and you can easy hold armenia till 9, this mean you got turn 1 5 and 9 reinf, enough to hold , and russ can just push till turn 15, because normally revo kills russ income and reinf, so even if otto lose armenia the units left there will be few and easy to retake when revo hit russ.
So the last front is gallipolli, and here i will explain in long text how to counter dread rush. This is so far the most unbalanced and for it the most effective way (and faster) to kill otto, in my opinion the main problem is entente dread rush(fra and uk and sometimes italy but lets not count italy) they can sent 1 dread per turn(8 min atack) so they kill 2 CG each turn minimun, and 4 CG if dreads crit, so after galli lose CG, dreads have no counter in galli, but oh wait, there is istambul.
So what to do vs galli dread rush? You have to wait to lose majority of coastal guns in galli, so then you can wall spam galli-istambul, and retreat your inf to istambul before galli cant be defended, this makes art rush useless in istambul because you got enough inf there already, and istambul have 10 reinf to keep spamming coastal guns, by the time entente will be able to take istambul using the 1 dread per turn tactic, but otto will last long enough to be easy saved by bulg or austria.
For me the main problem is when romania rush otto early turns(bulg is too weak early turns and austria still have to handle serbia and cant help) because if you combine rom rush whit galli rush, otto will lose all the inf vs rom arts, so now uk have 2 options to rush istambul, it is either art spam or dread spam, if otto full spam coastal guns in insta turn 5, uk will art rush, if otto make cruceirs/CG uk will dread rush, so otto have to make both, but this is also weak, rom will wall spam edirne istambul front, and uk will hold istambul. Best way to balance? So the main problem why otto is so weak in my opinion is istambul front, i was thinking in 2 trenches in edirne, this way rom rush will be less efective and will lose more troops taking it and/or 9 hp coastal guns only (ONLY) for galli so this way 1 dread per turn will be less effective and entente will have to waste more reinf doing this. I was thinking in 2 trenches for galli but if rom doesnt rush this will be too OP buff for otto. Remenber ater turn 9 it is too easy for bulg and austria to help otto if they are good.

Sorry for the long text but i see people always talking about otto is too weak but i just see it is bad played

3 trenches would ruin AH income, no tnx
also if austria cant manage to stand 200 cons on an offensive then he should not play, and if his prussia cant take advantage of it then he shouldnt play, and the very fact that the situation was an option can tell that the austrian and prussian players suck

Furthermore, I consider that NWE must be destroyed

CP is stronger than Entente. Change My Mind.

Agree with point 2, for most part disagree with point 1 and 3. Puchao summed most of the things up correctly . Yet I would just like to add that Russia almost always dies anyway, further curbing it's potential by removing opportunity to rush AH just makes the faction more bland.

AH being full rushed is a strong strategy, it was so from the first time it was done. It still requires good co-ordination though and a good AH can come out of it.

Imp Russia mass funding the west is a dreadful strategy imo. Yet in a way, comparable to WG mass funding Prussia. Have WG go Iron Fist and Prussia imp if you expect people to do this ''Russia funding west strategy'' is what I would advise you. Western front isn't a 2v1 also as Prussia is usually there around turn 15-20 and sometimes earlier to turn it into a 2v2, sometimes even AH supports. Keep in mind that the Entente has to break to trough the trenches in order to score the SP win at turn 50, since Central powers are ahead in sp after they (almost certainly) kill Russia.

WW1 won't be unbalanced if it doesn't exist

I just want people to utilize uboats more often and give them a fighting chance vs massive income west navy lol.
Every moves is pretty much overplayed and i wanted to see something new.

लिखा द्वारा MoS, 10.02.2019 at 12:43

CP is stronger than Entente. Change My Mind.

CP is normally stronger than Entente, MoS is right. Buffing turk is only good thing

लिखा द्वारा DireWarlord99, 10.02.2019 at 11:36

In response to the need for Germany to get a buff, one thing I have seen is that the use of Heavy Artillery completely changes how the west front was once fought. Before, France and Uk would only push once tanks were available, causing a major stack warfare that needed hundreds of soldiers and tanks to win. With the new meta of rushing with Heavy Artillery, I think we need to ask ourselves is does Heavy Artillery need to be change so that the rush is not always effective at killing Germany before t30. I do believe that Germany needs extra cash for fighting a naval war. Many players who are Germany just won't make U-boats or even a navy because they want to make sure Prussia and the rest of CP can get funded when asked, or need to make Heavy Artillery to counter an early rush.

When this scen was fresh out we did early HA spam rush regulary, but not like we do it now, or at least some of us.

Btw, Galipoli became stronger than ever with this new update, 5 buildable trenches in it. Before Gali had 1 event trench and 6 buildable units, no trenches, and even before that 2 buildable units, trenches included.

CP just needs top player to be Austria-Hungary, and 2nd top to be Ottoman Empire. Those two roles require the most game skills, yet people often don't choose wisely. Another thing to consider is that CP can rush France and win, prove me wrong. I won many games with WG with that only.

लिखा द्वारा BigAssGoth, 10.02.2019 at 12:36

Sorry for the long text but i see people always talking about otto is too weak but i just see it is bad played

Totally agreed,I wasn't killed in a long time

लिखा द्वारा Guest, 10.02.2019 at 17:27

CP just needs top player to be Austria-Hungary, and 2nd top to be Ottoman Empire. Those two roles require the most game skills, yet people often don't choose wisely. Another thing to consider is that CP can rush France and win, prove me wrong. I won many games with WG with that only.

UK and ha,I think this is enough to say

PD otto never get broken and requires only a small extra input of cash. Honestly if you think otto is weak maybe you need to change how you play it.

Saying cp is stronger than entente must be some kind of prank

लिखा द्वारा Witch-Doctor, 10.02.2019 at 18:02

PD otto never get broken and requires only a small extra input of cash. Honestly if you think otto is weak maybe you need to change how you play it.

Always play imp to spam all the trenches,cruisers CGS I need with 0 funds and nearly always survive

लिखा द्वारा bubartem, 10.02.2019 at 18:05

Saying cp is stronger than entente must be some kind of prank

IKR. I cant believe some of the shit im reading. I don't even know where to begin. I think these people are pr'ing each other and colluding to troll us.

My personal favourite so far.

लिखा द्वारा Guest, 10.02.2019 at 17:27

Another thing to consider is that CP can rush France and win, prove me wrong. I won many games with WG with that only.

लिखा द्वारा Permamuted, 10.02.2019 at 18:30

लिखा द्वारा bubartem, 10.02.2019 at 18:05

Saying cp is stronger than entente must be some kind of prank

My personal favourite so far.

लिखा द्वारा Guest, 10.02.2019 at 17:27

Another thing to consider is that CP can rush France and win, prove me wrong. I won many games with WG with that only.

Entente is indeed stronger, but what njab says is right. WG can spam quite a bit of attacking units early. I've seen many an IF shred right through french trenches

In defence of cp I can say that Prussia can fairly easily cripple Rus,and if ah has good start it's a beast,can easy kill Rus or Italy before t20 event which is basically gg,the problem is that competent entente won't let ah have easy early game and keep annoying so it can't make proper rush